whitewolf don't hate you man.

No, we are the best of friends. :D
He might not hate me, but he doesn't like me.
And you know what? Meh.

Whitewolf, as you know because I’ve said it several times now, I don’t debate or argue. I won’t waste either of our time “defending” myself or trying to convince you of anything. I will suggest instead that you do some research on mystical literature from the various world religions, certain non-dual philosophies from the East in particular, and epistemological questions in philosophy. This stuff is hard to convey in general, especially to someone who has not done this kind of search. If you were also genuinely interested in understanding, you might want to consider relaxing your ideas about what you think is and isn’t possible. For you, the idea of oneness sounds absurd, even insane, much like the idea of unconditional love I imagine. Which is ironic for a theist. I suppose God’s unconditional love for you is as “schizo” as mine is, at least in your mind. Which, as I have also said repeatedly, is fine.

Toby, I’m in my mid 30’s. I was once a seeker. I sought the truth thru all sorts of isms and ologies, including atheistic materialism and had all kinds of experiences. As far as my stance in the world, belief systems aside, what I am left with is the wisdom of love and compassion for all. I know. It’s crazy to some and heretical to others. But oddly enough, I’m ok with that. I stopped needing other people’s respect ages ago.

You don't debate? How do you get anywhere?


LOVE, THE TRUE BELIEF by Brian Clement

"A life without love seems hardly worth living. It's so important for each of us to grasp the understanding of the depth of feeling that can be generated on all levels of life, through love."

Love should be the most important thing in everyones lives, as humans we spend most of our lives seeking love, Love is the foundation of all worthwhile activity.

Do you have self-love? Odd question, I know.

Whitewolf -
You don't like the way I quote things do you?
I found one more fitting to you...
“Be yourself, don't take anyone's ****, and never let them take you alive.” :D

Whoops! Forgot about this. For me, using debate as a means to get somewhere was a surefire way to get nowhere fast. In my own experience, debate has been used by debaters as a means of confirming what they already wish to believe and not as a means of finding clarity. I value internal clarity more than I value proving myself right.

Tell me, Ecce, have you found love? Do you have a wife, girlfriend, or kids? Or are you a virgin? :P British or American? Real first name, please? Thx

You are way to curious for your own good.
LOL

I “love” the quote Toby. It’s awesome and has the ring of truth. But then again, from a slightly different angle, from my own experience it isn’t possible to live without love. That, to me, would be like living without reality, which again, is impossible.

By the way, I also appreciate the display of your own wisdom in there Toby.



On the deepest level, there is nothing but love. But back to normal speak, yes, I suppose I do.

Psycho1 – with an auspicious name like that you won’t be surprised if I don’t give you very personal information. ;-) At least, not at this particular moment. I will say that I have experienced romantic love on several occasions, was married and am now divorced (learned LOADS from that experience), do not have any kids (that I know of) and, to move back into abnormal speak, love is not something you find. Love is what you are. As such love is far deeper than any romantic notions or feelings about it.

Thank you, I wish there were more people out there like you... ;)



Lol :D

It's hard to imagine a life completely void of love, but as you said, they've never experienced love so don't know otherwise and have never experienced any different...


Psycho1 - Odd choice of name... Conjures up all sorts of Hannibal Lecter type images...

LOL! Right? I realized, as my previous comment to Whitewolf indicated also, that I am speaking about things that frankly most people haven’t even begun to consider. What is obvious to me, after years of searching for something bedrock within religion and spirituality, is the exact opposite of obvious to most others. Hence the riddle-like speech. I apologize for that. I don’t speak of what I have seen much in my offline life for precisely this reason. I may be winding my commenting down on this forum because of this. I need to focus on embodying the peace and love I talk about here.

Don't apologize, I understand you! :D

I understand what you mean, while understanding what Whitewolf does...
I see why Whitewolf says that you speak in "riddle like speech", but also I know that although it sounds like riddles it is infact the literal truth as you see it.



:( I will miss your posts here if you leave, you're one of the good'uns. :D

Ah good. There isn’t any point in using guru-speak if no one understands, is there? There isn’t any ultimate point to using it at all, but again, that’s another story…

So you asked me why I go to church. Do you? Go to church I mean? I wonder how many Christians are out there who are like you. And by that I mean, per your own words, you group yourself in with the Protestants but you also know they don’t quite reflect everything you believe in. I say that because in one of your previous comments you say you don’t “specifically fit in with any religious group”. I told you why I don’t. Why don’t you?

Yes, I do attend a church, every sunday without fail.

Why don't I fit in with any religious group, do you mean?
I feel that a person should make their own informed decision and personal interpretation of Bible. Protestantism isn't for me, and I don't feel any specific religious group is. They all have at least one specific view on a subject that I disagree with. For example, I fell out with the preist over my opinion on abortion, I am pro-choice and he, was not.
Needless to say, I didn't feel welcome there anymore. :( LOL

Ecce, are you in Britain at the moment? Just curious, feel free to withhold it if you wish. :D

Yet you go to church faithfully. Interesting. Do you feel alienated at all when you go, or do you just enjoy what you are experiencing while you are there?

Nope, I’m not in Britain. I’m in America, land of the free, home of the brave.

I attend a protestant church because I feel protestantism is where I best fit in. Church allows me to feel I am closer to God, and participate in group prayer. Although I don't always feel completely comofortable, It's where I think I best fit in.

Great! And you didn't throw an insult at Britain?! Yay. :D

See, why would I throw stones at the UK? In fact, it's one of the countries I'd love to visit before my time on Earth is up. It's on my Bucket List.

The world is one great big ole family as far as I'm concerned!

Christian views aside, we are all supposed to of started out in Africa as one race, and then spread to the corners of the Earth, so yes we are one big family. We're all incestuous. :D

Thanks, most people upon hearing I'm from Britain, usually go on about how British accents sound and how **** my country is. It's one of the only things I let get to me too much.

First, let's define God as the thing which represents the divine to us mere mortals - in Platonic terms the ideal form of a human.

Next, let's consider that the appeal to a higher authority is one of humankind's strongest, albeit logically flawed, arguments. The concept of God is a very useful thing in a parent's or governmental type ruler's arsenal.

Finally, realize that the world is positively crawling with people and we've GOT to get along to have any kind of peaceful existence.

So, God is very real.

He is the concept of something better than myself to which I aspire to become like, knowing that I will fail but recognizing that the closer I get to this ideal, the better a human I will be.

He is the measure by which you reflect upon your life on your deathbed so that you can die peacefully, knowing you have led a "good" life.

He is the example by which you pattern your behaviour governing interaction with other humans.

He is present in every culture and every civilization since time began. He is at once a creation of our own invention and more than any of us could ever be.



I could have written just that, verbatim.