I know both Jere and presumably Wini love my habit of quoting themselves back to them but hey, you say you are Christians, so forgive me.

Wini -

“I agree with the rules and regulations that Jesus gave us in his blueprint how to live (the Bible)”

Did Jesus write the Bible? I keep asking this question and yet you still do not answer.

“there own big ego. Believing in what is good for them and only them at the expense of EVERYONE else in society ... their family, their spouse, their children, their neighbor, law, employers, co-workers ... everyone and anyone they can exploit and NOT have to take responsibility for their actions, unless, of course, they are caught and their butts are tossed in prison.....All atheists must be either attorneys or related to attorneys who want the world to stay in chaos cause it feeds their own selfish agendas”

Umm, do you seriously believe that there was no chaos in this world before the rise of secularism in the west?

“I'd like to add my 2 cents in about anti-social personalities, whether they be Narcissist, psychopaths, sociopaths, or just plain selfish pain in the Butts ... the obnoxious personalities we all have to deal with ... and yes, the immaturity and selfishness of the children raised in the last 40 + years has more than sent the statistics of these self serving PUNKS through the roof. I can't even call them adults, no matter what age they are chronologically. They are spiritually stunted individuals that have never read, comprehended and obeyed God's wisdom”

Well, you most certainly do not come across here as a superior person who knows better than all the rest. Judge not, lest yea be judged?

Which leads nicely to Jere -

“I'm not Angry ! You cannot prove that God does not exist! And I know he does! And If I am wrong I don't lose anything!”

-You write as though you are very angry
-You cannot prove that God, as YOU think he exists, with the PARTICULAR HISTORICAL RELATIONSHIP TO THE WORLD that YOU believe he/she/it holds, exists
-You don't loose anything? So the criterion of judgement is not what is true, but what is useful to your life? How Nietzschean! Perhaps you are not without ego yourself!

“The Bible is a History Book ,not a romance novel with me on the cover! :) The History is of Gods relationship with man. What was writen in the old testament was fullfilled in the New Testament! Go back and read it again perhaps it won't be as difficult to understand or believe! Peace !”
Umm, there's plenty of Jews who might disagree. Why, exactly, are they wrong, and you right? If its a history, which is a report of facts that happened, then how can there be such disagreement?

see next post...

“I purpously included the entire paragraph for the exact reason . He does not believe there is any purpose for faith nor any worth to it. He said that! there fore those who do believe and have faith are less than INTELEGENT! He wants to prove with science what is beyond science! Prove wind! Prove soul? prove Love? Get It?”

HE SAID THAT THOSE WHO BELIEVE IN AN IDEA, RELIGIOUS OR OTHERWISE, BECAUSE OF FAITH (BECAUSE THEY READ IT IN A BOOK/HEARD IT FROM A WITCHDOCTOR_CUM_PRIEST/BECAUSE THEIR PARENTS TOLD THEM THAT IT WAS UNQUESTIONABLY TRUE), ARE INDEED IDIOTS. THIS HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE IDEA ITSELF

An example – I believe that all humans are descended from apes. Now if I believed it because my Dad told me this was true, and after all, apes kind of look like us, I WOULD BE AN IDIOT.

If instead, I am given a statistical framework that demonstrates how simple features which are advantageous for an individual, imply that over time, given that the features are repeated randomly by variation at birth over and other again, that that feature is likely to become prevalent in a species and given sufficient time can potentially lead one population of that species so far away from another population of that species that they become incapable of interbreeding and therefore can be considered separate species... I have THOUGHT AND UNDERSTOOD the idea for myself, and can take it as a useful idea, one that I can apply to new situations and new species by myself, independently of what any one else thinks. I can explain, evaluate, and refine the idea myself, instead of viewing it as a monolithic TRUTH that never changes and therefore is beyond question


“First You say that you agree with dr.Psyco that Faith and religion are for the week minded and uneducated! Then you turn around and Use Christian Values and Jesus's teachings to try to Learn me something ? AMAZING! And that was my point from the start! You can not preach one direction and do the opposite , that is Psycopathic! It's easy to sound/read Nice ; Live well! It's a whole nother ballgame to Practice what we preach! “

Christian Values, that is, the nice one (not those parts towards the end of the new testament about beating women and keeping them out of churches), are ideas, and ideas can be judged by yourself.

e.g. Treat all human beings with compassion = A very good idea, I think, and one I think might have occurred to me without Jesus.

The joke of your life is, you really believe that, If someone aside from Jesus had not written that it was a good idea to love each other in a book called the Bible, that we MIGHT NEVER HAVE THOUGHT OF IT. This is exactly what the Dr. is writing about when he slams faith. The idea that we should love each other as brothers is great. THE BELIEFE THAT THIS IDEA COMES FROM A JEW WHO LIVED 2000 YEARS AGO, AND HIM ALONE, AND IF YOU DON'T BELIEVE IN HIM AND HIS EXCLUSIVE RIGHTS AND JURISDICTION OVER THIS IDEA, YOU WILL BE SENT TO INFINTE SUFFERING IN HELL, FOREVER, BY A GOD WHO LOVES YOU, INFINITELY, is offensive to me, and I reserve the right to employ my 'God given' reason in questioning it.

“Question; what is the opposite of LOVE?”

-I'm sensing a lot of it from you, Jere. You can talk of praying all you want, I know I have, but all jesting aside, would you please state if you do or do not hate Dr. Robert? I'm sure can find a Bible passage to quote to you either way. The idea is not that WE live up to a book that you hold up as the truth, sole truth, only truth, but that YOU live up to it, and in full, before you espouse it to us.

James

I don't know dr.robert! There are people I do not care for! I hate no one!

James you have to admit that the dr. regards any religion as a weekness? You said yourself He slams religion!
When a Human being who believes in a higher Authority than dr. reads this from a professed professional ! This is why I came off as angry or typed angry. He Pulled his own punch which He claimed not to do and I read it from the beginning!

For All I know, No one will get it Right! Life that is. But the Teachings of Jesus seem the best path ! If your right I still have lost nothing because all we are is dirt anyway. Does that make since?

I, others and even Dr. Robert have explained this over an over again, and yet you do not understand.

Religious IDEAS are not the same things as Religious FAITH. FAITH is accepting an IDEA as true, beyond question, because you have been told to/because you "feel" it must be so/because it makes you happy, and NOT because you have considered it for yourself, independently of anyone else, and, upon critically examining it for yourself, believe it to be true.

It is the existence of religious FAITH that the Dr. is critiquing, not the existence of religious IDEAS. Some of these IDEAS, of course, he judges to be good, and others bad.

We have all been most clear on this point, most of all Dr. Robert in his articles which you have repeatably misrepresented and misread. I see no use in replying to you any more and leave you in peace.

If you really are stuck on this, I would suggest reading several extensive, philosophical definitions of the words "Objective" and "Subjective". You can access these on the internet. Googling "Standford encyclopedia of philosophy" and "wikipedia" would be good places ti start. Read them, and please think on them. If you think you already know what these words mean, I can only disagree with you and urge you to re-examine.